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Democratic Senate candidate James Webb (left) hugs his wife, Hong, as Sen. George Allen, R-Va., stands with his wife, Susan. |
RICHMOND--In a debate that was at times contentious and even out of control, Sen. George Allen and challenger Jim Webb faced off on television last night.
It was the last scheduled debate before the Nov. 7 election, and it afforded the candidates a chance to question each other--an opportunity that led to the most testy exchanges of any debate they've had.
Allen went into the debate needing to turn the campaign's focus off his verbal missteps--such as calling an Indian Webb staffer "macaca" in August--while Webb went in still needing to introduce himself to voters.
It was clear from the opening statements that they intended to use the debate in those ways, with Allen vowing in his first sentence to "discuss issues that matter" and then reeling off a list of his accomplishments as governor.
Webb used his opening to talk about divisions of class within society and how America "needs leaders who understand these divisions" and can work to overcome them.
Allen made a point of tying Webb to liberal Democrats like Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y.--who has endorsed Webb--and Sen. John Kerry of Massachusetts, accusing Webb of wanting to raise taxes that those senators have endorsed.
That was part of Allen's first direct question to Webb, although he spent so long asking it and quoting Webb to himself that time was called before he actually got to the question, which was whether Webb knew how many Virginians had benefited from tax breaks that Webb wants to end.
Webb said what he opposes is the migration of wealth to the few, and the idea that America can have huge tax credits and still spend money on expensive things like the war in Iraq. He said he wants to close corporate loopholes that allow many very profitable companies to get away with paying very little in taxes.
In response to Allen's question about how many Virginians benefit from tax breaks enacted after Sept. 11, Webb countered by asking Allen if he knew how many Virginians would suffer from the rollback of a tuition tax credit Allen voted against.
The exchange left the two testily talking over each other, with moderator Russ Mitchell trying to bring order.
"You're misrepresenting to the voters of Virginia how I would vote on a wide array of taxes," Webb fumed during a later question.
In addition to questioning each other, the candidates were asked questions from Mitchell--a CBS anchor--and a panel.
American involvement in Iraq came up, with both candidates repeating positions they've stated in earlier debates. Allen said he "wants our troops to come home, but in victory, not defeat" and said American security would be threatened if Iraq is allowed to become a haven for terrorists.
He said Iraq's rich oil deposits make it more important that terrorists do not control it; he contrasted that with Afghanistan, a poorer country, noting that terrorists based there were still able to do a great deal of damage.
Webb said he wants a diplomatic solution to the Iraq situation, and would like to get neighboring countries involved while troops remain nearby but outside Iraq.
Accusations that Allen has made derogatory slurs against African-Americans came up, as Mitchell asked Allen if the people who've made those accusations are lying.
Allen has in the past denied that he ever used the "n-word" to describe blacks, but said last night that he does "not recall using that word." He said they are "baseless accusations," and that voters should look at his record to know who he is.
Webb had to defend his own past statements, most particularly his 1979 article outlining why women should not be in combat. Women who attended the Naval Academy at that time have been in Allen ads saying that article poisoned the environment and led to harassment; others have appeared in Webb ads defending him.
Webb said last night that he's comfortable with where the military is today, and that people have only to look at his campaign--where women hold several key positions--to see where he stands.
At one point, Mitchell pointed out that before Allen's macaca statement, he was 16 points ahead in the polls. Now it's a statistical dead heat, and he asked why Allen thinks that happened.
"The campaign got off on other things that were not issues some of it I brought on myself and some were just smears of the campaign," Allen said.
Webb said he thinks people just started paying attention.
On other questions, Allen said he supports the constitutional amendment on Virginia's ballot in November that would ban gay marriage or civil unions.
"This is a way to protect the values and views of the people of Virginia from activist judges and their elitist views," Allen said.
Webb opposes the amendment--on legal, rather than religious, grounds, he said, saying he fears amending the constitution in such a way would have unintended consequences on other contracts between couples.
Both men were asked whether taxpayer dollars should be used to build worker centers for illegal immigrants, such as was proposed in Herndon.
Allen said he doesn't believe "we ought to be rewarding illegal immigration with amnesty." He wants to build a fence along the border with Mexico.
Webb said the Bush administration has failed to stem the flow of illegal immigrants, and that worker centers like that in Herndon are merely a response to relieve a growing problem.
Although the race is not for the House of Representatives, the candidates were asked if they think House Speaker Dennis Hastert should resign over the scandal involving Rep. Mark Foley's sexual e-mails and Internet messages to underage pages.
Webb said he hasn't followed that scandal in detail, but thinks if the "leadership of the Congress did not live up to the standards of the Congress, there should be accountability."
Allen's response was that Foley's actions were "deplorable and despicable" and that he supports a full FBI investigation into it. Anyone who put politics ahead of protecting the pages, he said, should go, and not receive a congressional pension.
In his closing statement, Allen reiterated that "issues matter" and sought to align himself with Sen. John Warner of Virginia.
Webb appealed to voters who, like himself, had at one time identified with the Republican Party.
"Just remember the Republican Party has lost its way, and I would hope many of you will decide to come home," Webb said. He added that power in America should flow from the bottom to the top, that Washington is filled with lobbyists and that senators need to be lobbyists for their constituents."
Virginia Commonwealth University political analyst Robert Holsworth said both men had "moments of political eloquence," but the debate also had "moments in which it spun almost completely out of control."
To reach CHELYEN DAVIS:
Email: cdavis@freelancestar.com
